HBO "Fire From Heaven" TV series?

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Sivi

HBO "Fire From Heaven" TV series?

Post by Sivi »

Checking up on movie progresses I noticed apparently Mel Gibson is trying to produce a 10-part series "based" on Mary Renault's books... Unfortunately when I clicked on the link to investigate further, (filmjerks.com) this may only be rumor, but it didn't sound too true to the novels... i.e. - Alexander falls in love with Stateira after Issos and has an intense love affair (gag) and then falls apart when she dies. I think they are confusing Stateira with Darius' Queen, whom he was *not* involved with... Stateira was what, 12 when the family was captured? Argh. And it got my hopes all up too. (T\*) This same thing happened when I heard they cast Leonardo DiCaprio... I was practically in convulsions. Le sigh.
Any thoughts?
ruthaki
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Re: HBO

Post by ruthaki »

Typical Hollywood fiasco. How do they dare mangle Renault's accounts which, though fictionalized, were so beautifully rendered??? The 'hot love affair' they refer to was probably the one he had with Barsine who was said to have taught him the art of love. He didn't marry Stateira for quite awhile later and was shortly afterwards dead. But, we all know how Hollywood skews things in order to make a more sensational story.
jan
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Re: HBO

Post by jan »

I can hardly believe it. First of all, Mary Renault is pure fictional nonsense, and has no credibility. Secondly, Leonardo is not a suitable actor to portray Alexander as only body builders and muscle men should ever even be considered.Unless they come from the WWF or the boxing league, I do not think any credible actor could ever be seriously considered for historical accuracy.
Linda
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Re: HBO

Post by Linda »

I don't think Renault is fictional nonsense - fiction based on fact, with some interpretation. Renault doesn't mention Barsine - who didn't teach Aexander the "art of love"; she was his mistress, perhaps his first, but no-one knows the exact intensity of their relationship.Linda
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Re: HBO

Post by sikander »

Greetings- my feelings here are that the artificial muscularity of todays steroid wonders is also not appropriate.. there *are* men around who have incredible physical strength without looking like they walked out of a bull pen. I would prefer to see naturally muscled men and women rather than artifice to the degree present today in either gender.
As to Renault, her interpretation and understanding of the essence of the times is still better than most fiction, which is why her books stand the test of time, so far. It is difficult to write a character that reflects its own world and time rather than the era and national origin of the author; Renault understood this and tried to bring a fresh perspective for the times in which she wrote. Regards,
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Re: HBO

Post by amyntoros »

Hello:This is my first post to the forum though I have been reading and enjoying the conversations and debates here for quite some time now.I have also seen the site with the supposed scripts for the HBO mini-series, though I have no idea what their sources were. However, the series has been scrapped! It was reported in Variety on or about August 15, 2002 that "Mel Gibson's 10-part mini-series (on Alexander the Great) bit the dust after Gibson left the production." LindaAnne
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nick
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Re: Stateira and Stateira

Post by nick »

Hello Companions -Hm, to clear this up: at Issus Alexander captured two Stateira's: one the wife AND sister (yes, those Persians!) of Darius III who was claimed to be the most beautiful woman in all of Asia. The second the daughter of Darius III and Stateira who was also called Stateira (but is sometimes referred to as Barsine). (Persian kings switched names as they ascended to the throne: Arses became Artaxerxes IV, for example. It is not out of the question that Darius' daughter might have shared the name Barsine with Alexander's mistress when she was still a girl, changing that to a more distinguished Stateira later on.)Now Darius wife Stateira died in childbirth somewhere between Issus and Gaugamela. Curtius leaves us plenty of room to believe that it was Alexander who had made her pregnant and her death might have occured shortly before Gaugamela in 331 BC. Arrian goes to great lengths convincing his audience that Alexander never touched this greatest beauty of Asia in a remarkable feat of self-discipline. That would leave us no other clue than believing that Stateira died in 332 BC and that it took more than a year before the news of his wife's death reached Darius. Hm.If a TV-series exploits this controversy to suggest that Stateira wife of Darius was Alexander's greatest love - a passionate romance conceiled in the mysts of history - the historical evidence for this approach is very thin. But it makes a good story. There is something to say for using that to capture the attention of a modern audience. Quite creative, I think.Regards -
Nick
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Re: HBO

Post by jan »

I appreciate your objections to steroids, but the point is that naturally muscular men such as the Macedonians resulted from their real labor, and that they were very muscular and not a bit puny.As for Renault, an author projects his or her imagination into a character, and the reader rides with the character. Just as some could not read along with Manfredi, I find that Renault is a person whose portrayal of Alexander is too much Mary, and not enough Alexander. I simply at one point in attempting to read her characterization of his youth said no way, this is preposterous and could read no further. She lost me. I understand that she is a great student of the period, but as for her interpretation, I found it very lacking. You may like her. That is your privilege. I read her book the Nature of Alexander, and found that its impersonal approach to be commendable, but once she begins to interject her own personality which I found deplorable, I said NO.Don't you wonder at each and every person who becomes interested in Alexander? I imagine that those who are history students have cause, but for the amateurs, I do wonder at what draws their interest to Alexander.He has been eclipsed over the ages, so that modern history has no comparison. I am always intrigued by the comparisons of Napoleon to Alexander. I am sure that Napoleon was under his influence, but to what full extent one can only surmise. Both had to to trek to Egypt, and that alone intrigues me.I simply do not believe that any of today's adventurers could ever accomplish the feats that he did in the kind of costumes, sandals, and armor that those early Macedonians used. Look at what it takes to climb Mt. Everest today. Imagine what Alexander accomplished and lost in the mountains of Afghanistan, in the deserts. I also do not believe for one minute that he threw away a drop of water just to be an example for his troops in the desert.But I will confide (if you have read this far) that I had an experience in which I found myself in the person of Alexander addressing his troops just before the battle of Issus. The thing that I recall the most is the muscular thighs and arms of the men of his army. I also found myself aware of the vitality which is within him that moved his troops to follow him as he did. It rekindled the vitality within me as well. That pothos is dormant within.You can choose to believe it or not. The proof is in the reenergizing force and in the be
jan
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Re: HBO

Post by jan »

I like the way that Paul Doherty includes a passage from history before each chapter, and thus, develops his fiction prompted by the arid factual sentence.That is imagination using a footnote of either Plutarch or Arrian as a stimulus to his imagination.Hollywood devices are used to find an audience who will prompt ratings and therefore huge sums of money.Those who write for the purpose of enlightening a reader in a serious purpose are more enjoyable. Hollywood is all fakery and everyone knows it.If someone finally does execute a great movie of Alexander, I would hope it would for its artistic merits, and not its box office appeal.
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Re: HBO

Post by Linda »

Jan said
" The thing that I recall the most is the muscular thighs and arms of the men of his army. "Don't worry, I have had those kind of dreams as well.. :)I would agree with you that Mary Renault's interpretation of Alexander's character is problematic - too much the "universal boy scout", however, she is undoubtedly a better writer than Manfredi or any of the others, and I don't think you can seriously question her handling of the facts. A bit, but not excessively, although someone can probably prove me wrong...
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Re: HBO

Post by andrewt1978 »

I agree with you. It is very rarely that historical figures are acurately portayed in a mainstream movie.
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Re: Stateira and Stateira

Post by susan »

Another explanation is that she didn't die in childbirth, and that since this was the usual cause of death in women of child-bearing age, it was incorrectly assumed that she had done so. This would have been the gossip version anyway, no matter what the cause.Curtius 4,10 says she died of hardship and grief, and repeats Arrian's story.Susan
jan
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Re: HBO

Post by jan »

Hi Linda,Thanks for your understanding. It does sound humorous though the actual dream sequence was anything but humorous. I like the idea of being surrounded by handsome men myself, and am slightly annoyed with myself for being so naive as to share this information.I talk to myself all the time about these kind of experiences as where in the world can one find someone who is capable of understanding? We all react to one another betraying our own insecurities and jealousies no doubt.Years ago, I had gone to a couple of groups in California who were exploring the concept of reincarnation. I bought a couple of books there which i still have in my possession, and placed them in some strongbox somewhere. A woman by the name of MeiLing, chinese, I believe, wrote some beautiful pieces regarding twin souls and reincarnation.At any rate, I also went to see Gina Cerminara at a local group gathering and heard her story about Edgar Cayce. So I am not new to the world of the belief in reincarnation. However, I had had no thoughts about myself and who others may have considered me to have been. They all seemed to try to get me to explore my mind, but I was slow in so doing.As all of us are always suspicious of souls who claim to have been famous people, I am one of the most suspicious of grandiose and pretentious personalities.However, for the record, I don't imagine that only a maniac would want to have claimed the lives of so many people as famous warriors of the past have committed. So while I could see similarities between my personality characteristics and some of Alexander the Great's personalities, I had no idea of claiming someone so awesome as Alexander. I got worn down frankly and only upon resignation and self admission did I finally confess such a possibility. (Nobody could stand me for that I don't suppose! I know I would not like anyone who would ever assert such a claim.)While I confess that we all like to be flattered and the pictures and portraits and achievements are really flattering of ATG, I doubt that any are seriously a true accurate picture of either his deeds, his appearance, or his personality. Kings are always highly exaggerated figures.But that experience of reliving the real life energy within him has had an effect and impact on me and my daily living. I consider him to be a bit of a saviour to me. And it also contrived that my social security number is tied in to his dates as a woman from Egyp
jan
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Re: HBO

Post by jan »

I don't know why it is that some of my messages get trucated. But Linda, if you are still listening, it was a woman who works at a local department store who alerted me to ATG by a number. I realized then that she was talking about me. She is a woman from Alexandria, Egypt, and she told me that Alexander is her favorite. She is a news woman and author of books as well. Because of her, I picked up a book on Alexander by Arthur Weigall, which opened my eyes to the truth of the comparisons between ATG and myself. So being open minded, I began a search and rescue study of self and soul.That is all it is about at this point in time. I maintain that unless I get into their skin and see life through that person's eyes, I won't stake a claim. I guess a lot like claiming horses in Hollywood Park. (LOLO):-)I refrain from killing people in this lifetime as I (am laughing aloud again) am often tempted to do. The question is like an old joe karbo joke, but what if I am? I maintain that the same god can do whatever god wants anywhere, anytime. So be it.
Tre

Re: HBO

Post by Tre »

Jan:I would have to agree with Sikander here, and to borrow a quote from Alexander "I would rather be Renault's Callisthenes than Manfredi's Alexander, anytime, anywhere." :-)Renault borrows heavily from Plutarch and occasionally from Arrian and even Curtius despite her protestations against the latter. I didn't much care for Fire From Heaven as it was disjointed, but I thought The Persian Boy to be entertaining, although she took great liberties with Bagoas' character. I wouldn't consider either book to be her best work, but she has no equal in Ancient Greek historical novelizations and despite some more recent good work such as Pressfield's Gates of Fire, she remains the mark to beat.I am however, interested in your getting in Alexander's head. I am somewhat familiar with reincarnation - are you saying you think you were Alexander or are you saying you think you experienced being there? In any case, the reason you keep getting cut off is your replies exceed the length alloted for a response.Regards,Tre
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