Dear friends,
Talking/debating in friendly manner with respect is very fruitfull and is as a...must need...!Talking about this issue, every and each of participients has some kind of "right" to some extend about topic. However, most striking and maybe the key for solving this, and other great mysteries, is that nobody is considering vice -versa approach to this and all topics. If one start talking and seeing things from different angle, maybe a bit... of ray of sunshine would come in to his way..., and my too. What that means! Well, if somone want to be objective, he/she must have to have analitical aproach form both side in the debate. Here,I will say only this, there were some interesting findings in Italy, nth. of Italy, and there were various interpratations of same until somone start analyzing them from different perspective- Makedonian one. (It was about some words therefore origins of ancient tribes, Veneti connections!)To do so, one must take curage and to "forget' about any statments re: Makedonia from various sides, but to admit that it was, and it is Makedonia like thousands of years ago. He/ she will find remarkable evidence about everything that we are discussing now, and will see clearly that Alexander and Makedonians, did not consider Pelopones (Hellenic City States) as foreign, becouse it was Makedonian land, as was Trakia, and Aristotle- The Macedonian. (Aristotle's father was medical doctor on Makedonian Royal Court- Philips and, and as Aristotle, was considering himself as Makedonian). So, in effort to make connection to my goal of this comment I will simplify this as folows:... Einstein was no so much different from others, no, but he had, on the top of his intelligence, amaizing "free" approach towards problems, analyzing them from different/ opposite perspective, opposite of how were they presented until than. Even he himself did not agree with his findings and consider some of them as mistake, but years later, after WWII they were fundament for something even bigger and is shaping our future science...So why don't try different aproach for a change with more "free" style approach, getting out from "iron" curtins presented until now, when is obvious that there is only very thiny missing link, and is nothing to do with narcisoism or simular...The Light 7000
What did GÇ£being GÇÿGreekGÇÖGÇ¥ mean in Ancient GÇ£GreeceGÇ
Moderator: pothos moderators
Re: What did GÇ£being GÇÿGreekGÇÖGÇ¥ mean in Ancient GÇ£Gree
Hi Vasko, just two comments:1. Modern day citizens of FYROMacedonia are Slavs.
"We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians. That's who we are! We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his Macedonia. The ancient Macedonians no longer exist, they had disappeared from history long time ago. Our ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century (AD)."
(Quote from FYROM'S President Mr. Kiro Gligorov.
March 15, 1992)
Or else:
In reply to another question about the ethnic origin of the people of FYROM, Ambassadorof FYROM in Washington Mr. Achevska stated that "we are Slavs and we speak a Slav language."
Or open any engyclopedia...2. Now regarding Aristotle:
Son of Nicomachus and Phaestis, Aristotle is considered the most important and most methodical mind of the ancient world, and was the founder and pioneer of many fields of science. He was born 15 years after the death of Socrates, and 3 years after the founding of Plato's Academy, in Athens.Orphaned at an early age, he was brought up by relatives at Atarnea in the Troad, where he received a good basic education. In 367 BC, at the age of 17, he went to Athens and was accepted at Plato's Academy, where he spent the next 20 years, first as a pupil and then as a teacher. He attitude towards the elderly Plato and his associates Speusippus, Xenocrates, Eudoxus and Heraclides was both critical and creative. In 347 BC - the year Plato died - Aristotle moved to Assos, where he spent the next two years and where he met his former student and colleague Theophrastus, who invited him to his own city of Lesbos. He remained there, teaching, until 343, when Philip II of Macedonia invited him to come to Pella to be the tutor of his 13-year-old son Alexander. He spent the next two years in Pella, and then moved to Stagira to continue his own work. In 338 he went to Delphi, where he studied the historical records of the oracle. He returned to Athens in 334 to teach in the "Lyceum" (a public gymnasium in the neighbourhood of the present National Garden), and spent the next 12 years in that city. He became the head of the Peripatetic school of philosophy, and worked closely with Theophrastus, who was to succeed him as its head. After Alexander's death in 323 BC, Aristotle was forced to leave Athens. He retired to his mother's property at Chalcis, where he died a few months later.
or: http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/biograp ... htmlCheers,
Yiannis
"We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians. That's who we are! We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his Macedonia. The ancient Macedonians no longer exist, they had disappeared from history long time ago. Our ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century (AD)."
(Quote from FYROM'S President Mr. Kiro Gligorov.
March 15, 1992)
Or else:
In reply to another question about the ethnic origin of the people of FYROM, Ambassadorof FYROM in Washington Mr. Achevska stated that "we are Slavs and we speak a Slav language."
Or open any engyclopedia...2. Now regarding Aristotle:
Son of Nicomachus and Phaestis, Aristotle is considered the most important and most methodical mind of the ancient world, and was the founder and pioneer of many fields of science. He was born 15 years after the death of Socrates, and 3 years after the founding of Plato's Academy, in Athens.Orphaned at an early age, he was brought up by relatives at Atarnea in the Troad, where he received a good basic education. In 367 BC, at the age of 17, he went to Athens and was accepted at Plato's Academy, where he spent the next 20 years, first as a pupil and then as a teacher. He attitude towards the elderly Plato and his associates Speusippus, Xenocrates, Eudoxus and Heraclides was both critical and creative. In 347 BC - the year Plato died - Aristotle moved to Assos, where he spent the next two years and where he met his former student and colleague Theophrastus, who invited him to his own city of Lesbos. He remained there, teaching, until 343, when Philip II of Macedonia invited him to come to Pella to be the tutor of his 13-year-old son Alexander. He spent the next two years in Pella, and then moved to Stagira to continue his own work. In 338 he went to Delphi, where he studied the historical records of the oracle. He returned to Athens in 334 to teach in the "Lyceum" (a public gymnasium in the neighbourhood of the present National Garden), and spent the next 12 years in that city. He became the head of the Peripatetic school of philosophy, and worked closely with Theophrastus, who was to succeed him as its head. After Alexander's death in 323 BC, Aristotle was forced to leave Athens. He retired to his mother's property at Chalcis, where he died a few months later.
or: http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/biograp ... htmlCheers,
Yiannis
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smittysmitty
- Hetairos (companion)
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Re: What did ?being ?Greek?? mean in Ancient ?Greece??
I guess mothers have sons, and sons become kings!How acknowledging a prince's maternal background would jeopardise his position as direct heir, I don't know; if anything, I would imagine it enhanced his prospects by indicating to the powers that be, he could muster up additional forces in times of war, create a greater econimic climate, enlarge his kingdom, etc. re perception; Illyrian/thracian questioning! If Alexander was
asked by an Epirot, was he an Epirot? What would he say? If Philip and his brothers were asked by a Lynkestian, were they Lynkestian, what would they say? I think on all accounts they would say "Absolutely" Would you agree with these points Tre?Re; misunderstanding your original post, I may have. I assume you imply the Makedones perceived themselves to be Greek, more so than the other progressive Greek states due to their maintaining of the 'old ways' as in the Iliad? If I've got that wrong, I'm sorry! If thats right, and you have academic proof to back it, my recommendation is you seek publication immediately. I'd be interested to read it, as many others would.
asked by an Epirot, was he an Epirot? What would he say? If Philip and his brothers were asked by a Lynkestian, were they Lynkestian, what would they say? I think on all accounts they would say "Absolutely" Would you agree with these points Tre?Re; misunderstanding your original post, I may have. I assume you imply the Makedones perceived themselves to be Greek, more so than the other progressive Greek states due to their maintaining of the 'old ways' as in the Iliad? If I've got that wrong, I'm sorry! If thats right, and you have academic proof to back it, my recommendation is you seek publication immediately. I'd be interested to read it, as many others would.
Re: What did GÇ£being GÇÿGreekGÇÖGÇ¥ mean in Ancient GÇ£Gree
Hi VaskoI do agree with you: Debating in a friendly manner is one of the most exciting opportunities this forum gives us. It contributes to the expansion of our knowledge concerning ATG and the history about him.
You are also right to defend your point of view and debate with me if your opinion differs from mine. BUT until now my friend we never had a real debate. I mean, I never received any comment on any of my previously posted statements in any of the threads in this forum, and GÇôtrust me GÇô they were very different than yours.Do not misunderstand me, I do not want this forum to become a debate GÇ£arenaGÇ¥ for us, but at least for someone preaching a more analytical approach on subjects I think you could offer to the participants of this forum some of your undoubtedly vast knowledge by responding and analyzing the opinions posted on this forum. For exampleComment on Enlightement attempt by Panos on Tuesday, 16th September 2003 and relevant postsRe: What did GÇ£being GÇÿGreekGÇÖGÇ¥ mean in Ancient GÇ£GreeceGÇ¥? by Alex K. (GÇÿPerseusGÇÖ) on 11th October 2003The debate about the Spanish Zeus, are few examples of knowledge lost for us because you simply did not do a step-by step analysis or comment on the different opinions. I would like to think that it is because of your very busy schedule, so I would appreciate if you found the time to do so. We could start another thread GÇô if it is ok with the webmaster GÇô for other people to participate.
You are also right to defend your point of view and debate with me if your opinion differs from mine. BUT until now my friend we never had a real debate. I mean, I never received any comment on any of my previously posted statements in any of the threads in this forum, and GÇôtrust me GÇô they were very different than yours.Do not misunderstand me, I do not want this forum to become a debate GÇ£arenaGÇ¥ for us, but at least for someone preaching a more analytical approach on subjects I think you could offer to the participants of this forum some of your undoubtedly vast knowledge by responding and analyzing the opinions posted on this forum. For exampleComment on Enlightement attempt by Panos on Tuesday, 16th September 2003 and relevant postsRe: What did GÇ£being GÇÿGreekGÇÖGÇ¥ mean in Ancient GÇ£GreeceGÇ¥? by Alex K. (GÇÿPerseusGÇÖ) on 11th October 2003The debate about the Spanish Zeus, are few examples of knowledge lost for us because you simply did not do a step-by step analysis or comment on the different opinions. I would like to think that it is because of your very busy schedule, so I would appreciate if you found the time to do so. We could start another thread GÇô if it is ok with the webmaster GÇô for other people to participate.