Ancient Macedonian

[dean]

Me again, are there any linguists out there who could tell me if Macedonia had its own language? I read that it was a seperate Indo-European language related to "Tracian" or "Ilirian" meaning that it wasn't simply a dialect of Greek. Does anybody know if it actually was a separate language? In Renault's novel "The Persian Boy" she definitely makes the distinction. In the article I was reading, it mentioned that at the trial of Philotas, before a multiethnic crowd, Alexander offered Philotas the possibility to defend himself in ancient Macedonian.
Best regards, Dean.

[ruthaki]

Greek was the official language of the court, and of the educated (Alexander and his Companions) but the common language was a Doric Greek patois.

[dean]

Hi Ruth, do you think that it would perfectly understandable to a Greek person from Athens for example, this Greek Doric Patois that you mention?
Dean.

[ruthaki]

The Athenians didn't have a very good opinion of the Macedonians. Thought they were rather 'rustic'. The Doric patois they spoke (the common people) was a dialect and no doubt understood by the other Greeks. But in educated circles and the Macedonian court, proper Greek was spoken. I think this was likely the influence of old King Archelaos who had brought in the Greek influence when he built the new palace at Pella. (I also believe that Alexander and Philip usually spoke the Macedonian patois when they communicated with their common soldiers)

[maciek]

Hi!
i think not only Archelaos brought greek culture, customs and LANGUAGE to macedonian court. All Argeads did it.Maciek

[Jim]

Boy, you opened a Pandora's box. Much debate on that point. Macedonian names (indeed, the name itself) are Greek, but apparently there was enough distinction that historians differentiate between Macedonian and Attic Greek. But then again, you also find in other writings reference to "Greeks" speaking in Doric or Peloponese. Regardless, by the time of Christ, Macedonian was subsumed by Attic Greek, which leads me to believe they were related, Macedonian being a Greek dialect that evolved separately from between 1,000 B.C. and Alexander's time, which accounts for the distinct differences.

[Mil]

It is simplistic to assume that there was one greek language (spoken in the state of Athens) and a patois greek one in the state of Macedonia. The reality of ancient greek language is far more complex. Linguists believe that early in the second millenium BC, there were numerous greek dialects. There is unmistakable evidence of different greek dialects in the very early works of greek litterature, the Iliad and the Odyssey of Homer.From then up to the time of Alexander the Great a large quantity of greek texts survives and proves the existence of at least five major dialect GROUPS.
Not all greek dialects served as vehicles of litterature. The five major greek dialect groups known were: Ionic, Aeolic, Homeric, Doric and Attic.Attic was the language of Athens, an offshoot of Ionic.Although some still debate wether or not Macedonians were hellenophones, although every evidence shows that they were, it is obvious that the Macedonians enlarged considerably the greek world.The conquests of Alexander had important linguistic consequences. A new lingua franca emerged which, with a few exceptions, gradually replaced all other greek dialects. It is called the KOINH DIALEKTOS (in english, the koin+¬). It became the language of the greek man in the street and was used by the writers of the new testaments.Educated classes, however, regarded it as a debased form of greek.The koin+¬ greek dialect, that we owe primarily to the macedonians, is the linguistic ancestor of modern greek (demotic greek).

[Mil]

I must apologize for not introducing myself, since this is my first appearance on this forum.I am of Greek origin,(primarily greek but also with Italian and Maltese ancestors) as my name testifies. My first name is Miltiadis (the name of the Athenian general associated with the battle of Marathon).I was borned and raised in the Belgian Congo and Belgium before moving to Montreal, Canada.I must congratulate you for your forum. It is serious, instructive and civilized. I must confess, reading through the postings, I feel humbly less knowledgeable, although I do have a passion for history and etymology.I am looking forward to learn more through this forum and site.Keep up the good work !!regards, Mil

[dean]

Hello, nice to hear from a fellow lover of history and etymology.
Thanks to Jim,Maciek,Ruth and yourself for taking part in helping me to deepen my understanding in the lexical aspect of my study into Alexander the Great. Best wishes Dean.

[dean]

Hi, two questions- what are hellophones? and where was Doric and Homeric Greek spoken?
Thanks,
Dean.